M20 Star Wars

[Nomad4life]

Ok.  I have some ideas for a Microlite version of Star Wars.  Actually, I've been kicking them around for a long while, I just never got around to putting it all together until now.

How does this work?  Can I just post my notes here, or is there something more I should know first?

[Darth Cestual]

Go for it! I'd love to see what ya got cookin'!

[WildWalker]

Cool! My Redjacks is a Star War-sy hack. Can't wait to see what you come up with!

WildWalker

[Dr. Bull]

This is exciting!

The challenge is to create a system as brief and elegant as M20.  Luckily, Star Wars already functions as a d20 game.  I had a few thoughts about classes  --  take them or leave them...

Star Wars characters a little more powerful than D&D characters (am I right?).  Each gets a little boost in skills.  The Fringer and Noble are hybrid, skills-based classes.

Soldier = Fighter combat bonus, +2 physical and +2 technical
Fringer = +2 survival, +2 physical and +2 repair
Noble = +2 communication, +2 knowledge, +2 technical
Scoundrel = Rogue stealth attack, +2 stealth and +2 technical
Jedi Consular = Cleric spells, +2 communication and +2 knowlege
Force Adept or Sith = Wizard spells, +2 knowledge and +2 to any skill
Jedi Knight = Cleric spells, +2 communication and +2 physical

Other challenges:

Force Powers (spell lists would need alteration)
New Skill Use (technology use, repair skill, survival skill, etc...  any others? Maybe pilot?)

The technology end (blasters, etc.) shouldn't be too much of a problem...  Just adapt a watered-down version from the original rules.

I don't know if this helps or if it just confuses the issue.  

- Dr. Bull

[Slortar]

You know, the list of things that Jedi/Sith can do with their powers is so limited it might even be more compact to just write up a custom spell list.  Off the top of my head, you could get by with something like this:

Force Powers
Absorb.  4 pts. Roll Skill vs incoming damage to aborb energy.
Lightsaber Stuff.  4 pts.  Deflect blasters, throw saber for damage, and so on.
Mind Trick. 8 pts.
Move Fast/Jump Higher. 4 pts.
Move Object

Dark Side Powers
Choke
Lightning
Rage

Just something really brief with a spell point cost and one line of effect and you're good to go, I'd think.  If your players want something that's not on that list, it shouldn't be too hard to make up something cool in line with those effects.

If you want to differentiate between Consulars and Knights, you could let players choose a power or two to "specialize" in, which would give them a 1 or 2 point break in the cost, maybe.

[Peter]

I would go for something leaner, more like a boild down of SW Saga and SW d6

Soldier = Fighter combat bonus, +2 physical
Scout = +2 Physical, +2 Technology
Noble = +2 Education, +2 Technology
Scoundrel = Rogue stealth attack, +2 subterfuge
Jedi  = +2 any Jedi SKill, +2 Education or Physical


Skills:
Technology
Subterfuge
Physical
Eductaion


(Jedi Only
-Control
-Sense
-Alter)

(Jedi Powers based on Skills as in d6)

[Dr. Bull]

You guys rock!

I like the slimmed-down characters as well.  
Good job sorting-out the force powers...

Big question, though:  how do Jedi characters "pay" for force powers?  Should we use the hit point reduction like with magic spells?  It seems to make sense...  Yoda was pretty fatigued after using telekinesis several times...  

The only thing I miss is the communication skill.  I think it covers a lot of bases (diplomacy, bluff, intimidate, gather information and even using a com-link).  

So the skill list is:    Education (Knowledge), Physical, Subterfuge, Technology, Communication and Survival...  the two last options can be house rules (I don't use the Survival skill in my campaigns).  Piloting skill is important for certain characters as well.  Should we use DEX + Technology?  

Isn't M20 great?  In a series of 5 or 6 posts, a couple of people boiled-down a huge role playing game into a rules system that fits on 1-2 pages...

Now, Darth Cestual...  how 'bout that cool ship-to-ship space combat system of yours...?

- Dr. Bull

[Darth Cestual]

Now, Darth Cestual...  how 'bout that cool ship-to-ship space combat system of yours...?

- Dr. Bull

Be my guest!  :shock:  :lol: ).

[Nomad4life]

Wow!  What awesome posts so far!

I've been working on M20SW for some time now.  However, I keep running into the same three big problems: Jedi, droids, & starships.  I'm also really on the fence about adding two new skills: Tech & Pilot.  Sometimes I'm convinced they need to be there.  Other times I think they can be folded into existing skills.  I can't seem to make up my mind.

At one point, I handled the Force simply as a new separate skill that only Jedi had access to.  There was a general list of target number checks for doing different Jedi-like stuff with it.  That way, Jedi players could make up stuff on the fly, and the GM just gave them a target number to pull it off.  Now I'm thinking about scrapping that system as well and going back to something else.

So, I just keep adding more of this…  And more of that…  And tweaking this…  And tweaking that…  And before I know it, I'm not dealing with something that is "microlight" anymore, so I scrap everything and start over.  

But I'm determined to get this to work.  Keep posting any other ideas you guys have, and maybe we can find something that is still light, and feels Star-Wars-ish!

[Dr. Bull]

Nomad4life:

I agree, this is going well so far...

I like your idea of having a Force Skill.  Every three levels, the Jedi character learns a new brand of Control, Sense or Alter...  Thanks, Peter, for this idea.

So now we add Tech and Force to the Physical, Communication, Education and Subterfuge skills...  I don't think that's too crazy for such a complicated, trans-galactic campaign environment!

What about TECH + DEX for piloting?

As far as droids are concerned, I use the droid lists at the end of the book (I don't allow players to use droids as characters... it's too complicated).  Droids make perfect companion NPC's to the players...  They can be used as plot devices and help fill-in for missing abilities.

As I stated in an earlier post, Darth Cestual has done some great work on ship-to-ship combat.  I think that his system is quite elegant and in-keeping with the M20 tradition...

Is someone in the mood to write this whole thing up?  I bet Greywulf would be willing to post it in the front pages (provided copyright rules are not infringed...)  Right now I'm focusing on doing a M20 version of Call of Cuthulhu...  - Dibs!

Cheers!

- Dr. Bull

[Nomad4life]

Okay, the trick will be to process this in chunks.  Part of my problem is that I'm trying to do everything at once.  I need to nail down the first things first, and then move on to the next thing.  here's what I've got so far based on the suggestions in this thread…

M20 STAR WARS

Rolling up a character is the same as per the M20 Core Rules.

CLASSES
Soldier: Combat bonus; +3 Physical
Scoundrel: Sneak attack bonus, +3 Subterfuge
Expert:  +3 to Education OR +3 to Technical, and pick an Affinity
Jedi (Force-user):  Jedi training, +3 to Force skill


The Soldier and Scoundrel work pretty much like their M20 counterparts.  The Jedi/Force user will have some basic additional notes, but for the most part is exactly what it sounds like.  ("Jedi Training" is a class ability that allows those trained in the force to use lightsabers with a Soldier's combat bonuses, deflect blaster shots, and a few other simple "plot-device" things- more on that in the Force section.)

I've bundled all the scouts, diplomats, technicians, computer programmers, pilots, and other professions of the galaxy into the "Expert" class for unified simplicity.  The Expert class ability, Affinity, is explained later but in short it simply lets the Expert re-roll under certain circumstances.


SKILLS
Physical
Subterfuge
Technology
Education
The Force (Jedi/Force-user only)

SPECIAL NOTES ON SKILLS
Piloting = Tech + Dex
Survival = Education + Strength (or in some cases DEX or even MND)
Communicating = Education + Mind (to lay out a convincing argument while taking racial/cultural difference into account, etc.)
                 OR
Subterfuge + Mind (to fast-talk someone.)


After debating HP vs Vitality back and forth forever, I think I've just settled on tried, true, simple HP.

I'll have more details about Experts and Jedi later, but that's the gist of it for now.  I can't wait to get into how the force works, starships, etc, but as I said I need to calm down and just nail things down in order.

GENERAL NOTE: As you may have noticed by now, my version of Microlight Star Wars is based more on using the M20 Core and isn't a direct conversion from any one D20 source.  In other words, it is my idea of Star Wars based on the D&D open source.  (Although obviously the equipment list is borrowed, etc.)

The bad thing about this is compatibility- you can't just pluck things out of the RCR or Saga edition and use them as-is the way you can with old D&D modules and M20.

The good thing about this is that it avoids infringement issues, and the way you generate antagonists is identical to that of the M20 core so it should only take a few seconds to whip up some familiar bad guys.  (I'll provide some in the Antagonists of the Galaxy section in any case.)



NEXT:  Star Wars races

EDIT:  As always, feel free to jump in with ideas and suggestions!

[Nomad4life]

M20 STAR WARS RACES

Racial template formula: Each race is constructed using two Racial Template Points.  1 RTP is equal to:
-A +1 stat bonus
-Two skill points
-A special trait or ability (ussually an Affinity, which lets the player re-roll under certain circumstance.)

Unlike most other games with race selection, players of M20SW are STRONGLY ENCOURAGED to play around with the formula themselves to get the feel they want, pending GM approval.  Here are some suggestions/guidelines:

Humans: +1 to all skills (except for Force.)

Bothans:  +1 Dex & Will Affinity (May re-roll any check involving the willpower of the character.)

Cereans:  +2 Mind

Duros:  +1 Dex & Pilot Affinity (May re-roll any piloting check once per turn.)

Ewok:  +1 Dex & Stealth Affinity (May re-roll any stealh-related check once per turn.)

Gamorreans:  +2 Str

Gungans:  +2 physical, and Natural Swimmer (Can swim with as much fanfare as other character walk.)

Ithorians:  +1 Mind & Nature Affinity (May re-roll a survival check once per turn.)

Kel Dor:  +1 Dex, +1 Physical, +1 Force

Mon Calamari:  +1 Mind, +2 Education

Quarren:  +1 Str & Natural Swimmer (Can swim with as much fanfare as other character walk.)

Rodian:  +1 Dex & Tracking Affinity (Can re-roll any check centered around hunting down a specific target.)

Trandoshans:  +1 Str & +1 natural AC.

Twi'Lek: +1 Dex & Deceptive Affinity (Can re-roll any check centered around deceiving someone else.)

Wookie:  +4 Str; -1 Dex, -1 Mnd (Wookies kind of break the formula a little.)

Zabrak:  +1 Dex, +1 Physical, & +1 to any skill (including Force!)


Comments/suggestions welcome.  

NEXT:  Either the gear section, or my notes on the Force, depending on which one I finish first.


EDIT:  Note that a devious player could indeed come up with some pretty damn powerful class/race combos for some mad bonuses.  This is considered a feature, not a bug- the PC are supposed to be Big Damn Heroes, so let 'em do their thing if they want.  It's only a matter of time before they get blasted to pieces by some passing Stormtroopers they piss off anyhow, so what the heck, right?

[Nomad4life]

Expert Class Affinity

NOTE:  At first, this space was used to explain an alternate way to do the Expert.  I later realized that this made quick-stat NPCs a real pain and simply made the optional rule standard.

Affinities
What is an Affinity?  It is a narrow area of focus that your Expert has specialized in.  Simply put, the character can choose to re-roll any checks made under these circumstances.  (They are the same as racial Affinities except the player gets to pick one.)

Example Expert Affinities might include:

Piloting
Medical
Nobility
Droids
Starships
Repair
(Any technical crafting-like skill)
Computers
Deception
Stealth
Scouting
Etc…  You get the idea

Why have Affinities?  Why not just have extra skill points or something?
If a player wants to play a pilot, doctor, con-man, etc...  That is what they really want to be doing when it is time to play.  They're pretty much waiting around for the opportunity to do their thing, and this option lets them shine when they do it.  Furthermore, it lets them do this well without automatically making them good at everything else, or making the game more complicated.  It also helps differentiate between different types of Experts.

If the concept of Affinities sounds complicated, I have probably not explained it well.  In review:
-The Expert picks a broad area to be good at.
-The Expert can re-roll checks that fall under this area.

That's all there is to it.

However, if this still seems too complicated, no problem.  Just assign the Expert two floating skill points instead or something.

What if a player picks an Affinity that their race already provides them with?
Let's say a Duros character is also an Expert with the Piloting Affinity.  I would, believe it or not, let the effects stack.  That's right.  I would let that player re-roll twice if they wanted to!

Sound game-breaking?  I disagree.  Clearly, that player really wanted to be good at piloting.  I say…  Let 'em play the kind of character they really wanted.  Why not?

And hey, it's not like those stacked Affinities will be worth much of anything if they get themselves cornered in the back of some scuzzy cantina…  Aye?  

Alternately, you could simply rule that a character cannot pick an Affinity that is already granted by their race.

[Nomad4life]

M20 STAR WARS GEAR

I have two gear lists- Basic and Advanced.  The basic list is for players who aren't really into complicated gear lists and just want to play the damn game right now.  The advanced list is for players who want more detail and differentiation in their game, and is more of a straight-up conversion of other Star Wars games.  Rules for stunning are in the advanced gear list.  Costs are also in the advanced list.

For now, here is the Basic Gear List:

Melee
Knife-like/small weapons: 1d4
Medium melee weapons (club, short sword, etc): 1d6
Big melee weapons (sword, axe, etc): 1d8
Vibroweapons: 1d10
Lightsaber*: 2d8

Ranged
Slug thrower:  2d4
Blasters: 2d6
Blaster riffles: 2d8
Blast cannon: 2d10

*Lightsabers work differently in the hands of a trained Jedi.  More on that later.

Non-combat gear grants a +2 circumstance bonus depending on what it is used for.  A medpack might grant a +2 check to heal someone, for example.  Gear in this way is very free-form and rules can/should be made up as you go.

NOTE: Players of other D20 Star Wars games might wonder why blasters do 2DX of damage instead of 3DX.  This is to keep damage more in proportion to the standard M20 hit point setup.

NEXT:  Armor List

[Nomad4life]

ARMOR

Light
Blast helmet & Vest: +2 AC
Flight Suit: +3 AC
Combat jumpsuit: +4 AC

Medium
Generic Combat Armor: +5 AC
Stormtrooper Armor: +6 AC

Heavy
Corellian Powersuit: +7 AC
Powered Battlesuit: +8 AC

Assault*
Armored Spacesuit: +9 AC
Heavy Assault Armor: +10 AC

*Soldiers do not get their attack bonuses while wearing armor this heavy.

NOTES:
Soldiers can wear any armor, but lose their combat bonus in Assault-class armor.

Scoundrels, Experts, and Jedi can also wear any armor they wish.  HOWEVER, these characters cannot use their class abilities while wearing anything other than light armor.
In other words…

-A Scoundrel wearing combat armor cannot make a sneak attack, because it is a medium armor.
-A Jedi wearing a Corellian Powersuit does not have access to the force, because it is a heavy armor.
-An expert wearing a flight suit can still use her Affinity, because it is a light armor.  However, she could not use her Affinity while wearing Stormtrooper armor.
-A Soldier wearing Heavy Assault Armor does not get his combat bonuses, because the armor is too damn bulky.  But really, if a hero needs frackin' Heavy Assult Armor to get through an adventure, it may be time to have a word with the GM anyway.

NOTE: Oh, yeah, ignore all the who-can-wear-what if using the Basic Gear rules.  This is Advanced Gear stuff.

NEXT:  Advanced Gear List